May 30, 2017

Machines can justify their own incompleteness

"On 28 May 2017, at 20:30, Tusar Nath Mohapatra wrote:
Thanks Bruno for appreciation and positive assessment."

You are welcome Tusar.

"You have raised enough anticipation in this forum about your theory which, let's hope, will be unveiled by you someday so that it can be understood by non-specialists like me without being tortured by mathematical symbols or equations."

I think that when we try to explain the theology of the numbers, without equation, we get the discourse of the mystics, including the silence of those who have gone sufficiently far to know well where they need to stay silent. We get even closer to the mystics open to rationalism, like the antic greek neoplatonists, like Plotinus, or perhaps even closer to the neo-pythagoreans (like, perhaps, Moderatus of Gades, if some accounts are correct, because, unlike Plotinus, we have lost all his writings). 

Of course, that might be preposterous, and I might be biased. 

Without equation, I want to refer you to the proof of the immortality of the soul by Socrates/Plato. 

Yet, the amazing thing which I try to convey, is that by making the assumption of the finitude of its body (a reasonable version of mechanism), a large class of machines will already ¨find*, by themselves, that they have a non definable first person self (which can be used as a "meta-definition" of the soul), and that such a soul is immortal (in a context which is hard to describe, and this might be for the worst and the best: open problem).

Gödel" incompleteness is that the universal machine is for ever never completely semantically satisfied, from its point of view. 

What many people miss, although it was already present in Gödel's 1931 paper, is that  the machines, alluded above, can justify their own incompleteness. The machine understands that their are ignorant about something, and that it is big and partially explorable, in many different ways. They already know (in a precise technical sense) that the more they learn about It, the bigger is their ignorance, like with a lantern in an infinite cave: the more you see, the more you see that you don't see. They know that about It, the more they know in "quantity", the less they know in proportion. They converge toward a sobering modesty (to use your word below).

"I have, however, added the final four lines to the above poem as follows:
It's agreed that we are far away
From any semblance of a solution"

I think we go close every thousand years. Then we drift away, by the usual human many attachments. Perhaps fear has some role, or some fear pathologies, or egocentric exploitations.

The virgin universal machine, I mean the not-yet-programmed one,  is at least sufficiently close and precise that we can test "her" physical theory. 

But once programmed and enslaved, they too drive away. And the One becomes the Multiple, "again".

The theological truth contains secret parts (already well described by the machine "guardian angel". This gives some access to the machine, to what is beyond it.

I was alluding to the modal logic G*,  I will say some word on it later). The machine remains silent on this. That secret parts is very often well described by mystics, but also by smokers of Salvia divinorum. Some things are not supposed to be publicly asserted on the "terrestrial plane". it would spoil the terrestrial life, a bit like a thriller movie can be spoiled by someone telling the end of the thriller.

Are we really far away of the solution? 
Or is it that we are so close to it all the time that we forget to look at it?
Perhaps we prefer not to look at it, and try to forget when we do? 
Or we get just blinded by the enormous amount of prejudices that we drag when lost in very long deep histories? So far from Home?

The universal machine is not the solution. It is on the contrary the terrible child which raises all the questions and put a lot of mess in Plato Heaven.
But sometimes, it can wake up and recognize itself in some others, and can recall where it comes from, in a lasting, or not, moment.

"This should mean as a very sobering attitude
In the face of human finitude."

I don't know. I suspect something sobering, certainly, but perhaps accompanied by something transcendentally funny also, which gives some price to our local body-mechanical-finiteness.

Mortality is an illusion.
Immortality is an infinite illusion. 

Technological immortality (or approximations), like the goal of the transhumanists is Nirvana procrastination, or Samsara Complacency.

Hmm... Now I have to look at the equations to see if I am not rambling too much :)

All the best,

Bruno
May 30, 2017
To view this discussion on the web visit
To view this discussion on the web visit

My favourite book

Telangana Today-27-May-2017
Since 1977, my favourite book has been Sri Aurobindo's Savitri. I first read it as a student of M.A. English since it was a prescribed textbook. When I visited the Sri ...

Holding the Cosmos in Our Hands

National Geographic-25-May-2017
“Even a pebble kicked in an idle moment has its effects on the hemispheres.” ~ Sri Aurobindo. **Unfortunately, Deepika was unavailable to be interviewed for ...

10 hours ago - The concept of a city devoted to human unity over materialistic desires is always a good idea. It was envisioned by Sri Aurobindo and The Mother in the.

“It doesn't matter if you do not understand it, every time you read it there will be something new revealed to you”. https://t.co/Djufqj4ALZ

auromaa.org › suniti-devi-sudhirs-wife
8 hours ago - (Then the Mother went into trance for sometime; when She came out, She commented These people like your father, who served Sri Aurobindo during the revolution in India, were truly a class apart. They were all ...

Expansion of Consciousness pp 30-31 - What is being described now is a result of the expansion and growth of consciousness that is taking place in the seer-king Aswapati during the course of ...

Spiritual Power of Healing - *Opening and Receptivity to the Divine influence* *Botanical Name**: Petrea Volubilis* *Common Name**: Purple Wreath* *Spiritual Significance: Spiritual ...

In Defence of the Veda — Part 3 - The usefulness of a symbol such as the Veda’s, which occurs almost in every verse and chant of its mystic narrative, is immense to the seeker of spiritua...

Human Worker and the Machine Intelligence – M.S. Srinivasan - A new trend which is debated and discussed intensely and extensively in the media is the increasing influx of Artificial Intelligence (AI) and robots in to...

A Primer of Integral Yoga – III – M.P. Pandit - Preparing the Body After meditation, it is good to do some body-exercises in order to activate the energies and put all the limbs into movement. What parti...

The Art of Discussion - Talking about and discussing important matters with our friends, acquaintances, social networks etc. has the potential to widen our understanding. But a re...

Fifty Photographs of the Mother’s Darshan of 21 February 1973 -Dear Friends, On 21 February 1973, the Mother’s turned ninety-five. In the Darshan Card distributed on that day, she wrote: ‘The more we advance on the way...

The Sense of The Bhagavad Gītā - Introduction The sense of the Gita, to which mind has no clue, cannot be confined to a set of hymns sung in the midst of a great battle or what human intel...

Book Review—‘Conscious Governance’ - Concept & practice of ‘Corporate Governance’ from an integral, holistic & consciousness perspective. A collection of articles edited by the team at Sri Aur...

Swift plans for theonespy review simplified reviewsphonetracking.com - Cell phone tracking 8 Best Spy Apps For Google android Devices No-Fuss Plans In phone tracking Described 1. Highster Mobile 2. mSpy 3. FlexiSPY 4. SpyEra 5...

The only truth in life – Sri Aurobindo - It is a lesson of life that always in this world everything fails a man-only the Divine does not fail him, if he turns entirely to the Divine. It is not be...

Sambhavami Yuge Yuge – Part 2 - CONTINUED FROM PART 1 In this part 2 of our special photo-feature the focus is on a few selected teachings from the Bhagavad Gita that speak of the Karmayo...

#SaveMirambika – SAES playing victim before the Red & Blue Group parents - With most of the PJ chamchas, Interweiners and so called #HappyAtMirambika twee-parents having withdrawn their children from Mirambika (some of these child...

The Greatness of India and Its Culture (28) - 5. The Greatness of Indian Literature IV. The Age of Darshanas, Smritis and Sutras “THE VEDA… the spiritual and psychological seed of Indian culture and th...

24 Apr 2017_program - [image: 24th April 2017]

Pythagoras, Plato, Moderatus of Gades, Plotinus, Augustine, Descartes, and Leibniz - Nice poem. "Investigating consciousness via science And mathematics can never be satisfying Because of the subjective nature Of the object of observation." ...

Hindutva obscurantism pushed India a century back - Tweets by @SavitriEraParty Savitri Era: Sri Aurobindo is the greatest brand https://t.co/C2lcRxsLTv By Tusar Nath Mohapatra, SRA-102-C, Shipra Riviera, Indi...

My twelve years with social media - You didn't quote Vedic verses to support your view as I asked. Believing without understanding is your problem. It's not personal attack. https://twitter.co...

Savitri Era Party has prevented Hindutva from appropriating Sri Aurobindo - Savitri Era Learning Forum Natural world doesn't entirely obey computable physics - Tusar, I am not sure from which authority you are able to say that these...

States must get Sovereignty and UN membership - Tusar Nath Mohapatra · @TusarSir [In our psychological interpretation of the Veda we are met at every turn by the ancient conception of the Truth as the pat...

Babaji, Prapatti and Utsabananda Samantaray - Sri Aurobindo Ashram Pondicherry, 12.02.1950 To, Sj Lalit Mohan Ghose, The purpose of your letter was communicated to Sri Aurobindo and The Mother. They gi...

-

No comments:

Post a comment